Category: Emails and Q and A Responses

Dear Conrad Askland,
I am a college student and I’m interested in going into the recording business. Since that is your field I was wondering if I could ask you a few questions about the job.

What is considered more valuable in being a record producer, education or experience? Do you think you can do the job without a college education? Does a master’s degree increase your chances for getting the job? What do
entry level jobs pay? What are the chances for advancements and within what time frame? When you first started out did you always work as a producer, or did you start out as something else first? What would you say the job of being a record producer entails? What would you say happens day to day? And who are considered leaders in the field?

I really appreciate you taking the time to answer my questions.

Brittany *Last Name Edited*

*********************************

Hi Brittany,

Nice questions well thought-out. Happy to answer them. I had an email similar to this a couple weeks ago, and told the person not to listen to me because I don’t consider myself successful. But as I’m writing this today I’m working on the new launch of a new internet network, doing a lot of work for Toyota, and am working on a track for a very well known hip hop artist (a track that had previously been rejected by another artist at the same label, or should I say “the” label). So right off the bat, that’s what it’s like for me to be a music producer. No matter how much you’ve done, you always feel like you could do more and do better – and THAT to me is the key, the drive to keep improving.

.

There will always be better and worse than you, don’t worry about it. Create your own bar – don’t get pompous that you stomp someone else’s art into the ground, and don’t get so self-conscious that you think you are worthless. Very important stuff here. We are artists, we are sensitive, we feel to a greater degree than most people…..I think.

.
Enough poetry, here’s answers to your questions:

.
What is considered more valuable in being a record producer, education or experience?

It only matters what you can deliver. Just like Music Business is two words – “Music” and “Business” – the term Record Producer is two words “Record” (which has just stayed that way because CD Producer or Digital Download Producer doesn’t sound as cool) and the second big one “PRODUCER” – You have to produce. That’s all that matters. No resume or degree or contact will help you if you can’t produce. That being said, the EXPERIENCE of higher education and the KNOWLEDGE of real world experience is very, very important. Get all the experience you can. I was kicked out of college, and there were a couple jobs I couldn’t apply for because I didn’t have a Bachelors, but most jobs could care less. What can you DO.

.

Do you think you can do the job without a college education?

Of course you can. But the more knowledge you have, the wider base of talents you have to keep working on new jobs. So I highly recommend anyone who is really serious, to go to a 4 year college that has a well known recording and producing program. Colleges that come to mind would be North Texas State, Berklee and UCLA. I was kicked out of both Pacific Lutheran University and the University of Miami, but the years of study I had at those I put to use a LOT in the studio, and was able to do jobs other studios couldn’t. What I learned at college was theory and classical performance, all the audio work and engineering I learned on my own.

.
Does a master’s degree increase your chances for getting the job?

For education or corporate it might be important, but not for producing artists. The KNOWLEDGE may be great, but I wouldn’t worry to much about the papery. “Yo, this is Busta Rhymes. I heard your track, it’s great and I want you to produce my album. But I can only hire someone with a Masters Degree” – I don’t think you’ll run across that too much.
What do entry level jobs pay?
For studio work you’ll be getting $10 an hour if you’re lucky, and that’s after an internship. DO NOT go into music production if you want to make money. There are so many recordig studio schools now pumping “graduates” out like a mill. And they are all scrambling for any work they can get. It’s kind of sad.

.
What are the chances for advancements and within what time frame?

That’s all up to you. My biggest piece of advice, keep a cool head under pressure. It’s hard to find.

.
When you first started out did you always work as a producer, or did you start out as something else first?

I started as a classical vocalist when I was very young. Had very serious training. The highest profile of those was performing four operas with Seattle Opera. My first full time paid gig after high school was playing piano for Nordstrom when I was 19. Then I started working at a music store selling pianos and synths, and would give free lessons to close sales. So inadvertantly I started teaching piano, and a lot of people started asking me to record tracks to perform with. Jobs started paying more, had GTE hire me to do a lot of corporate work – I kept buying new gear, and that’s when it all started. I never set out to be a music producer, and never had a goal of having a recording studio. A path just opened and I went with it.

.
What would you say the job of being a record producer entails?

A record producer is responsible for making sure the final product is produced to the satisfaction of the client. That’s it. Now how to get there takes a lot of knowledge of music, engineering and dealing with people. I always make sure that the client and myself are on the same page before I start. There are some clients you will NEVER be able to please, or you don’t have the skill set to do what they need. So those jobs you need to be smart enough to turn down or your life will be hell. If I have a project I really want to do, but don’t have all the skillz necessary to complete, sometimes I’ll offer to do it at a reduced rate or even free, so I garner the experience. You need to get something out of the project: Money, Experience or Creativity. If you don’t get any of those things, don’t do it.

.
What would you say happens day to day?

Hard to answer. Five years ago I had my studio open to the public, was touring with a famous artist, and had a few other small commitments. So I was scheduled VERY tight, literally coming in from the airport and starting a session within 30 minutes. Also was working on marketing a large library of audio releases, so my days were easily 12 hour days 7 days a week. Now I’m working in live theatre and focusing just on soundtracks and composing. So my time is more focused on fewer projects, but the projects are much larger so they take more concentration and focus. For me, I enjoy this much more, which is why I changed things around this way. You need to know the environment you work best in, and then do it. For instance, I cannot get anything done until I’ve received payment from a client – so I demand payment before I start on a project. It’s not to cover my butt, it’s so I get the project done. Mozart had the same problem early on, couldn’t finish projects.

.
And who are considered leaders in the field?

Music producers past and present worth checking out:

Dr. Dre, Prince, Don Was, Rick Rubin, Mike Shipley, Sean Combs, Walter Afanasieff, John Paul Jones, Bill Laswell, Glen Ballard, Brian Eno, Trevor Horn, Quincy Jones, Jeff Lynne, Giorgio Moroder, Phil Spector, John Williams

Hope this helps. Maybe someday I’ll have my Grammy and someone will add my name to the list.

🙂

Conrad

Hi, my name is mike and i recently moved here to costa mesa. I found your email through searching google for becoming a music producer and found your site. I had a couple of questions

I have cubase and Reason 3. I use reason to make beats. I like the production in Bone thugs n harmonys E. 1999 Eternal CD Its very clean and well rounded… Anyways, one of my problems is most of reasons sounds are not that clean or nice as most professionally done resords, like bone thugs or Dr. Dre. are thier sites that have good reason samples.A better program..??

Im serious about becomming a professional music producer / engineer for both movies and songs. I would really benefit from information on how to become a better producer from how to arrange songs to know which sounds sound best with other ones. Do you think I need to go to a school or classes or is thier any online information…I know like one trick which is when you have a slow song addind a bit of reverb to the snare to open the mix up a bit… but more tricks that help you achieve a certain sound is what im looking for. Any information is very much appreciated – mike

*********************************
Hi Mike,

Big question…….hope I can be a little help. I did production for an Aftermath artist last year, and my style is very similiar to Dr. Dre in some aspects (No, I am not saying I’m as good as Dr. Dre) – The other producer told me when Dre heard the track he said “This sounds just like what I produce, you need to bring me something I can’t already do. I’ve already got this sound.” Really bummed me out, because it was a great open door for me to get involved with Aftermath. (For the record, I think if I could have met with Dre personally I’d be working at Aftermath right now, but that’s another story. Yo Dre, you reading this? Call me) – Now if I was knee deep in Aftermath productions, I would focus on tweaking elements to distinguish my sound more, but since that’s not the case, I keep learning everything I can – and continue using my own judgement for my sound.

You mention you have one ear candy trick. You need more. How do you get them? I can tell you what I’ve done. I highly recommend the Mix Bookshelf series as a whole – great books on mic techniques for different instruments, mixing, mastering, etc. I have easily a thousand music books in different styles, study tools for mixing techniques, tutorials, videos etc on every aspect of mixing and mastering I can get. At one point I even spent six months working with the Golden Ear training method.

Any time I meet an engineer I try to learn something from them – most people are happy to share their knowledge in little bits and pieces. I don’t try to impress, I try to listen and pick up everything I can – to me that’s the secret. Walk away smarter.

I’ve also spent a lot of time listening to reference CD’s of similiar mixes to the styles I’m working on. If I’m producing a punk band, I’ll have a major commercial release of a similar punk band style to reference for my mix. This alone has been the biggest single help in my mixes. Need to listen to a MAJOR COMMERCIAL RELEASE and listen to it on the SAME SPEAKERS YOU ARE MIXING ON. This approach is helpful to learn the rules before you get your own foundation.

I’ve seen a lot of bad info online – like a mix by the numbers program. Like anything online, make sure you’re getting your info from a good solid source. MIX magazine is great, I suggest you subscribe to it. Anything MIX puts out in it’s book series or recommendations is usually rock solid. The more knowledge you have, the larger palette of ideas you have to pull from, the more flexibility and creativity you’ll have in the studio. Keep in mind you never arrive at a final destination in your understanding of music production – it’s a constant evolution. The day you think you’ve “arrived” – is the day to quit.

You mentioned the reverb on the snare for a ballad – it’s important to understand the reasoning behind that. A ballad typically has a lot more space in the audio spectrum – so it lends itself better to effects. There is a great book on the Art of Mixing that can show you how to visualize audio mixes as a three dimensional environment. Panning is left to right, audio frequency up to down, volume and effects is back to front and width. This concept is also very powerful in bringing a quick visualization to your mixes. When you can see the mix in you mind’s eye like this, let’s say for a ballad, then you would see there is more space to use if you want, like reverb on a snare drum. Want to kick it up a bit more? Time the reverb so the tail closes in time with the beat, and put a delay on the verb so it doesn’t wash out the snare attack.

Turn it around – see that there’s a lot of space open in your mix, and just leave it that way. Purposefully leave out effects, have the vocal bone dry. The idea to internalize is that you need to have control of where you want to go – so the snare reverb bit you brought up is something that might work on one song, but not another. Intuition and experience will dictate to you what to do.

I have 15 years working at a public commercial studio with clients of all styles and walks of life – this was a great training ground for me. A producer is not a dictator to stomp on everyone’s ideas, with paying clients you need to accomplish what they want. When you’re in this environment, you HAVE to learn to do new things. So I’d suggest you get in that environment if you can.

For music schools, real and serious music schools – I recommend North Texas State, UCLA or Berklee. For a real deal education. There are a ton of recording schools out there, but I don’t personally know a lot of people working full time from those, might exist, I just don’t know about them. But I used to have like one person a WEEK come into the studio and want a job because they just graduated from a recording engineer school. But none of them understood music. To me, a music producer at a busy project studio is worthless without an understanding of music. So that’s my next piece of advice – learn music theory. It will keep you working when other people are looking for jobs.

For clean samples, you really should get them from the actual source if you can – otherwise there are lots of great libraries out there. Sony, Big Fish, ProSessions, ACID, to name a few. When I worked with the co-producer on the Aftermath project, all his samples were directly from an MPC. Another common trick is to run directly from the unit into a high end tube mic pre to fatten the sound, even if you’re dumping directly to a digital format.

Next piece of advice, think long term in your career if you’re really serious about it. For instance, I closed my studio in California last year – but I’m taking the down time to learn more about orchestras. I’m doing a lot of conducting with orchestral and choral groups. I could cry in my beer about the studio being closed, but once it’s open again, I’ll have a whole new set of skillz conducting orchestras – so when Dr. Dre calls me to produce a hip hop album with a real orchestra I won’t just be able to say I’m ready – I WILL be ready.

Hope that helps. Keep the faith.

Hey i do audio…and pretty decent at it if i sau so myself lolz..

n e wayz, i’m always learning new tricks when it comes to mixing and i was wondering if u have n e helpful tips with using reverb/compressor/and the equilizer….so yea what do say big guy? lol

Illbert Rhymestein
RapDogs.com

*****************

Hi Illbert,

I remember you from the forums. Major props to you and the Rap Dogs community. I listened to one of our tracks on SoundClick – “12-SupaStarr”

First of all it was a good track and good recording. You can definately play that in your car with pride. I’m assuming you want to elevate your skillz so let’s look at it more critically – to get it from “good” to excellent. Could this track be on a major label release? Sure, that’s a loaded question – anything could be on a major label release depending on the context. But if I was producing it there are some things I would do to it. I don’t have a Grammy yet, so maybe my advice is jacked up. (Key part of that last sentence is “yet”). You read, you decide.

Brush up on Hertz. 20hz is the low low end – 20Khz is the upper end of human hearing. So we refer to low end as 20hz (low end 808) – 80hz (low end on lowfi audio system) – 80-160hz (bass guitar) etc….up to 1khz – 5-6khz (human voice clarity) to 10-12khz (hi hats, cymbals sizzle).

Check out this link for info about Hertz
Wikipedia article on Hertz audio spectrum

Ok, let’s start! I wish I was at a mixing board, because I could do all this faster than it takes to explain it.
DANCING FOR THE EARS
Most tracks I hear don’t “dance” for the ears. Usually there’s a soundtrack bed and then vocals over the top. But to be “excellent” the whole track should be one entity – track and the vocals should present a unified front. So most of what I’m going to write here are things you can do to make this happen. Music should delight the ears, should be like candy. With lots of little elements to keep the mind interested and engaged in the production.

VOCAL MIXING
You have two different takes of the lead vocals (two leads at different spoken pitches) which is cool. But both are EQ’d the same. Your lead vox is usually going to be mixed center, if they have the samej processing then both leads are taking up the same audio space. What about thinning one of the leads out, or what about recording THREE leads – One center and full, and two slightly left and right thinned out a bit. Or what about recording EIGHT tracks of lead and stacking them. A lot of the major labels do insane amounts of stacking – that “wall of sound” approach. There’s only so much room in the audio spectrum – so give your lead vocal it’s window – and then eq the support leads so they don’t interfere with that window. Example: Boost the lead at 5-6khz maybe 2.5 db, then LOWER the background vocals 5-6khz 2 db. That’s the general idea of creating a window in the audio spectrum. Of course you need to adjust this by ear. I will pan the audio around the general frequency I want to tweak, in this case I would listen to where the clearness of the sound “jumps out” a bit – that would be the frequency I want to hit in this situation.

BACKGROUND VOCALS
Are the background vocals eq’d, compressed and effected the same as the lead vocal. If so, was that your intent, or did it just happen that way? I like processing the background vocals different – usually thinning them a bit, experiment with panning (make sure it’s balanced unless you intentionally want it lopsided). I also like using entirely different fx on the bgv tracks. Especiallly in hip hop – it really helps accentuate the different between the verse and chorus. Sometimes I’ll take a bgv and totally thin it out with a low end shelf – maybe cut everything from 4khz and below out, then drench in a long verb. Can be very effective. As always, the context of the music depends on what will work and what won’t.

WORKING WITH A PREMIXED TRACK
Assuming your background track is premixed – for hip hop you especially want that low end bass and sizzling hi hat. Try a little boost around 20hz for the sub to rock in a good car system (also check out around 80-120hz, which is the low end of a semi-crappy audio system – mix for the bad systems too). Then check out the hi hat action from 10khz to 12 khz. Add a little sizzle up there if you can. Another trick is to add some sort of processing to both the vocals AND the track – a way to make them sound a bit more like they belong together. You could try a light verb with the low end rolled off (like even rolling below 600khz off on the reverb – you don’t want verb on your 808 kick, etc.)

WORKING WITH THE ORIGINAL TRACKS
If you have the original tracks to work with I could write a book on how to approach it. But the thing to keep in mind is that everything should work together – let the vocals have their own space, and give each instrumental track it’s own flavor to keep the ears dancing. Work with panning so there’s movement between the speakers, and make sure the individual tracks are not getting the in frequency or panning space of the vocals.

REVERBS ON VOCALS
Try using two verbs. A short verb that will thicken the front of the vocal without being blurry – like a vocal plate set at 20ms or lower – then add a long verb with a delayed attack, like 20ms delay on attack to strengthen the sustain of the vocal. Or try short and medium verb – idea is to get two different fx working in tandem with your vocal. In general I don’t like to “hear” fx – if you listen to a track and say “oh, that’s a long reverb” then it might be too much. Exception is when it’s intentional to be that way. So crank the fx, get it tweaked where you want it – then back off to where you don’t hear it. I didn’t hear too much fx on your track, so sounds like you already understand “less is more”.

STACK THOSE VOX TRACKS
I got to work on a preproduction project for Aftermath last year and had the opportunity to work on the original protools session on my own computer. Talk about stacking! Twenty tracks for the lead vocal alone – and this was just for the demo! It was that thick. Try going nuts and stacking the hell out of your vocals and see what you come up with.

COMPRESSOR AND LIMITER
Another trick is to run the lead vocal on it’s own limiter at -.01db of peak, and run the track at let’s say -.05db of peack. This means the vocal will always be at least .04db above the track, regardless of what’s happening with each. For compression you should decide how tight you want the vocal compressed – in general if you can hear the pumping of the compressor – it’s too much. On an overall track compression would be very light – let’s say 1.5db at 2:1 at peack – but vocal could easily be 6db at 4:1 at peak, and you could even compress the vocal more from there. My experience is that you can compress the spoken word much more than a sung vocal track.

Hope that info helps. Keep in touch.

Conrad

Hello Conrad,

My name is SImeon *. I currently study piano and can play a variety
of instruments. I would like to ask you first off, how do i become a
producer of music. I would really like to know what are some of the jobs
that you have to do as a producer. Is it necessary to have contacts in the
music industry, and how exactly do i get about getting these contacts.

Thanks

SImeon *

***********************

Hi SImeon,

I’ll go in a little detail here, but need to tell you first off I might not be the best person to ask. My past experience tells me people don’t usually want to hear what I have to say…..in other words, they don’t like the answer.

First of all, to be a music producer…..you just need to produce music. I’m not being a smart alec here. Most people starting out waste their time worrying about contacts instead of focusing on the art, improving their skills, etc. The only way you do that is by doing it. As you go along, each project will teach you something.

DO EVERYTHING – DON’T JUDGE
When I was 21 I was playing piano in a mall 30 hours a week. It was an absolutely humiliating job, but I had to eat and was bound and determined I would only do music jobs. A customer came up and asked me to play Crazy, the country standard by Willie Nelson made famous by Patsy Cline. I was deeply offended they would even think of asking a classical musician to play country. My response was, “M’am, I play MUSIC.” I was dead serious at the time. In my mind country was not music. Well over the next ten years I played a lot of country music for a living, learned to appreciate how intricate it really is when it’s done WELL. And later even played the Grand ‘Ol Opry on national tv.

Now when it comes to the studio, I know a wide variety of country music styles and techniques which are used a LOT in the studio. You’d be very surprised how much it’s used on all sorts of soundtracks. I think of that story anytime I’m quick to judge a style as “not being music” – it usually is a sign that I don’t really understand the subtle nuances of the style. Be open minded.

DON’T BE AFRAID TO ASK
Know what I learned just this week? I learned that cellos have mutes. I never knew that before. Maybe everyone else does, but I didn’t. So I had the cello player perform several times for me with and without the mute so I could tune my ears to the difference. I also learned a flute has two different places that can be adjusted to set the overall pitch. These are things I would not have learned if I hadn’t asked. I asked these questions in front of my orchestra. I’m not embarrassed to ask about what I don’t know about, and have found that people do not judge you for not knowing. In fact people are excited to share their niche knowledge with you. When I was younger I would be more hesitant to ask, that it might be a sign that I didn’t know something. OF COURSE IT IS! Learn from everyone around you.

THEORY
Unless you’re going to do sampled hip hop or cut n paste productions, you need a good base in music theory. Learn all your major/minor scales and chords – and learn them so you don’t even have to think about it. At least learn everything up to 9th chords so you can do them in your sleep, I have to admit I still have to think about 11th and 13th chords sometimes depending on the voicing.

Why are scales and chords important? You’re conducting an orchestra and you hear the chord out of tune, you should be able to notice it’s the third that’s out of tune and be able to pick out the instrument too. This needs to be done fast, second nature. You get better by doing it. Aren’t working with orchestras? Same thing applies to a punk band: Let’s say you’re producing a punk band and one of the guitar strings is out of tune in a way that’s not “cool” (many times being a little out of tune on indie guitar stuff can be very cool) – You should be able to tell the player which string he needs to fix, whether it’s sharp or flat, and when your ears get really tuned in maybe you can tell him by about how much (your third string is 20 cents sharp, or tell him just to raise it a pinch). How do you know it’s the third string? You should know the strings on a guitar. Another thing you’ll just pick up as you produce projects.

START PRODUCING
You might be too young to know who Carol Burnett was, but her advice way back to starting artists was to book yourself solid round the clock with work regardless of whether it paid or not. Then once you’re booked up start replacing the free work with paid work as you go along. It really works. Of course you have to have a real passion for it to pull that off. But if you don’t have a passion for it then do something else. My motto for YEARS was “music or death”, and I meant that quite literally. As I’ve gotten older I see life a little broader now, but not much. 🙂

STAY AWAY FROM PROSPECT PROJECTS
My advice is to stay away from people that put a big carrot in front of you and talk big money. In my experience they NEVER come through. I’ve done big money projects, but they were always ready to move, none of this dragging it out for months stuff. Now if YOU want to back a project on your own terms that’s a different story. A good friend of mine from high school backed a little Seattle band several years ago with a goofy name. In fact about 5 years ago he emailed me wondering how I had done so much. Well times turned the tables on us – I’m currently trying to re-establish my record label and the band he backed became a cash cow for him – band’s name is Deathcab for Cutie. (Needless to say he doesn’t have time to return my emails now!)

JOBS TO DO AS PRODUCER
In my book, a music producer “produces results” – that’s what “producer” means to me. Whatever it takes to get ‘er done. You may have to pull from ridiculous sources, and of course you will have to be able to negotiate the rocky waters of artist personalites and temperaments. ALWAYS listen to what the client wants – it doesn’t matter if you are “right”, it matters what the client likes. They are paying (if it’s a job for a client). Clients will demand the impossible, and that’s when it gets fun because you have to learn new things whether you like it or not. As a producer you should understand acoustics, audio engineering, music theory, music performance, copyright law and have a general knowledge of the workings of any instrument, mic or audio unit you are using.
THE ABSTRACT PART
People have to like what you produce, at least the people paying the bills have to like it. When I started out it seemed like people rarely liked what I did, or I got lukewarm responses. It made me really mad, and each project I would work harder and harder on it. Now when I do projects it’s very, very rare people don’t like what I do – in fact I can’t recall right now when someone DIDN’T like something I did. I don’t know what changed, the whole time I was doing my best. Maybe I got better, maybe I “sold out” and tuned my ears to the general public, maybe I got better at reading clients for what they wanted. In any case, it’s experience – and as your experience grows you create your reputation. People want to know when they come to you that they will get what they want, and that should directly reflect in the amount of money you can command for your services too. Focus on the art, not the money – and the rest should follow. (I think…….)

DONT TAKE WHAT YOU CANNOT DO
Make sure you and the client have a clear understanding of what is expected, and don’t oversell yourself into something you cannot do. At some point you will have to deliver. This is also part of creating your reputation, before you accept a job make sure you’ve laid out all the necessary details of the project and if possible get it in writing.

Now go start producing…… 🙂
Conrad